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	<title>Comments on: Who Pays for Credit Card Rewards and Rebates?</title>
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	<link>http://thefinancebuff.com/2007/04/who-pays-for-credit-card-rewards-and.html</link>
	<description>like a friend telling you about money ...</description>
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		<title>By: TFB</title>
		<link>http://thefinancebuff.com/2007/04/who-pays-for-credit-card-rewards-and.html/comment-page-1#comment-1054</link>
		<dc:creator>TFB</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 22 Oct 2008 03:21:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.thefinancebuff.com/?p=96#comment-1054</guid>
		<description>John - Yes, I know in some other countries the customer pays a surcharge for using a credit card and I think it&#039;s a very fair arrangement. If one wants to get the billing convenience, added security, and rewards, he/she pays for it. If another person thinks it&#039;s not worth it, he/she doesn&#039;t pay for it. Unfortunately credit card surcharging is illegal in the United States.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>John &#8211; Yes, I know in some other countries the customer pays a surcharge for using a credit card and I think it&#8217;s a very fair arrangement. If one wants to get the billing convenience, added security, and rewards, he/she pays for it. If another person thinks it&#8217;s not worth it, he/she doesn&#8217;t pay for it. Unfortunately credit card surcharging is illegal in the United States.</p>
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		<title>By: John</title>
		<link>http://thefinancebuff.com/2007/04/who-pays-for-credit-card-rewards-and.html/comment-page-1#comment-1050</link>
		<dc:creator>John</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 21 Oct 2008 14:38:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.thefinancebuff.com/?p=96#comment-1050</guid>
		<description>You may or may not already be aware of this but in some other countries they have a solution for this.  They pass any transaction related costs resulting from your use of a credit card directly to you.  In that way there is an incentive to use cash, the prices do not have to all be raised just to protect from credit card users, and there is no mystery as to what the transaction fees are.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You may or may not already be aware of this but in some other countries they have a solution for this.  They pass any transaction related costs resulting from your use of a credit card directly to you.  In that way there is an incentive to use cash, the prices do not have to all be raised just to protect from credit card users, and there is no mystery as to what the transaction fees are.</p>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://thefinancebuff.com/2007/04/who-pays-for-credit-card-rewards-and.html/comment-page-1#comment-425</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jan 2008 06:12:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.thefinancebuff.com/?p=96#comment-425</guid>
		<description>I agree with a lot of the comments here. Credit card companies didn&#039;t raise prices on products. Sure some stores will include the transaction fee in products, but all that does is drive prices up in their store and smart shoppers will find other places to shop. Also stores can up prices for any reason and claim it was due to these fees even if it is not the reason. Again smart shoppers will shop around.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Plus many people spend with money they don&#039;t have (ie credit cards) and then don&#039;t pay of the balance. Not only has this, as other comments have suggested, caused an increase in spending (the merchants get paid their money) but credit card companies are making a killing off of interest and fees. With an average rewards credit card APR hovering around 19.4 percent thats a whole lot of money to throw around by the company. Take 1 percent out (as that is the most popular reward back amount) and hand that to the rewards program and those that pay off their balances in full get the rewards free and those who don&#039;t simply put the &#039;rewards&#039; right back into the system through interest plus the other 18 or so percent their still paying.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Rewards programs really pay for themselves and the most likely scenario is that companies take a fraction of different incomes they earn (say 0.2 % of merchant fees and 0.8% from interest payments and  late fees) to &#039;pay out&#039; 1% back rewards.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with a lot of the comments here. Credit card companies didn&#8217;t raise prices on products. Sure some stores will include the transaction fee in products, but all that does is drive prices up in their store and smart shoppers will find other places to shop. Also stores can up prices for any reason and claim it was due to these fees even if it is not the reason. Again smart shoppers will shop around.</p>
<p>Plus many people spend with money they don&#8217;t have (ie credit cards) and then don&#8217;t pay of the balance. Not only has this, as other comments have suggested, caused an increase in spending (the merchants get paid their money) but credit card companies are making a killing off of interest and fees. With an average rewards credit card APR hovering around 19.4 percent thats a whole lot of money to throw around by the company. Take 1 percent out (as that is the most popular reward back amount) and hand that to the rewards program and those that pay off their balances in full get the rewards free and those who don&#8217;t simply put the &#8216;rewards&#8217; right back into the system through interest plus the other 18 or so percent their still paying.</p>
<p>Rewards programs really pay for themselves and the most likely scenario is that companies take a fraction of different incomes they earn (say 0.2 % of merchant fees and 0.8% from interest payments and  late fees) to &#8216;pay out&#8217; 1% back rewards.</p>
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		<title>By: Sam</title>
		<link>http://thefinancebuff.com/2007/04/who-pays-for-credit-card-rewards-and.html/comment-page-1#comment-344</link>
		<dc:creator>Sam</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 09 Dec 2007 16:26:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.thefinancebuff.com/?p=96#comment-344</guid>
		<description>Y&#039;all are leaving the cost of handling cash. That is an important reason why fast food restaurants are now promoting the use of plastic. Plastic also inhibits theft by employees.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Y&#8217;all are leaving the cost of handling cash. That is an important reason why fast food restaurants are now promoting the use of plastic. Plastic also inhibits theft by employees.</p>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://thefinancebuff.com/2007/04/who-pays-for-credit-card-rewards-and.html/comment-page-1#comment-190</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Jul 2007 22:57:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.thefinancebuff.com/?p=96#comment-190</guid>
		<description>If the sales volume of CC transactions is less than half of a merchants total volume then people that pay cash are subsidizing that reward.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Say a merchant has $1,000,000 in sales of which $500,000 is paid w/ CC.  The merchant pays 2% of $500,000 ($10,000) to the CC companies.  This $10,000 is 1% of their sales so they raise prices by 1% to pay this cost.  &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;A person with a 1% cash rewards card would therefore about break even in this scenario, as the reward offsets the rise in prices.  A person paying in cash on the other hand would be 1% poorer, in order to subsidize the use of CCs by other patrons.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;It then follows that a CC user only comes out ahead with a reward if sales volume is less than half CC and lose money if its more.  Of course, people that pay in cash lose money in all scenarios but lose more as CC volume goes up.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;You really have to hand it to the CC companies, they have applied game theory principles masterfully.  If no consumer used credit cards then prices would be lower.  CC companies provide an incentive through &quot;rewards&quot; to use them.  But the &quot;reward&quot; is only a reward if a few people use CCs. And once CC use becomes dominant people still have an incentive to use them because they will lose less by getting a &quot;reward&quot; than if they paid in cash.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If the sales volume of CC transactions is less than half of a merchants total volume then people that pay cash are subsidizing that reward.</p>
<p>Say a merchant has $1,000,000 in sales of which $500,000 is paid w/ CC.  The merchant pays 2% of $500,000 ($10,000) to the CC companies.  This $10,000 is 1% of their sales so they raise prices by 1% to pay this cost.  </p>
<p>A person with a 1% cash rewards card would therefore about break even in this scenario, as the reward offsets the rise in prices.  A person paying in cash on the other hand would be 1% poorer, in order to subsidize the use of CCs by other patrons.</p>
<p>It then follows that a CC user only comes out ahead with a reward if sales volume is less than half CC and lose money if its more.  Of course, people that pay in cash lose money in all scenarios but lose more as CC volume goes up.</p>
<p>You really have to hand it to the CC companies, they have applied game theory principles masterfully.  If no consumer used credit cards then prices would be lower.  CC companies provide an incentive through &#8220;rewards&#8221; to use them.  But the &#8220;reward&#8221; is only a reward if a few people use CCs. And once CC use becomes dominant people still have an incentive to use them because they will lose less by getting a &#8220;reward&#8221; than if they paid in cash.</p>
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		<title>By: credit card assistance</title>
		<link>http://thefinancebuff.com/2007/04/who-pays-for-credit-card-rewards-and.html/comment-page-1#comment-155</link>
		<dc:creator>credit card assistance</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 Jun 2007 08:38:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.thefinancebuff.com/?p=96#comment-155</guid>
		<description>I think it&#039;s credit card holders who pay for the rewards. If you look at the reward credit card features, you see that they have higher than usual APR and annual fees. What&#039;s more, if you put just every purchase on your credit card, like most transactors do, your creditor also has its share. Companies are no fools really.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think it&#8217;s credit card holders who pay for the rewards. If you look at the reward credit card features, you see that they have higher than usual APR and annual fees. What&#8217;s more, if you put just every purchase on your credit card, like most transactors do, your creditor also has its share. Companies are no fools really.</p>
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		<title>By: KMull</title>
		<link>http://thefinancebuff.com/2007/04/who-pays-for-credit-card-rewards-and.html/comment-page-1#comment-106</link>
		<dc:creator>KMull</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 09 Apr 2007 14:06:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.thefinancebuff.com/?p=96#comment-106</guid>
		<description>I&#039;d say the answer is all of the above. I&#039;ve always just considered that the cc company has revenue -- from different sources (interest, merchant fees, etc.) and in return for my business (the fees my merchants pay for my purchases), I get a small reward.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;d say the answer is all of the above. I&#8217;ve always just considered that the cc company has revenue &#8212; from different sources (interest, merchant fees, etc.) and in return for my business (the fees my merchants pay for my purchases), I get a small reward.</p>
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		<title>By: Customers Revenge</title>
		<link>http://thefinancebuff.com/2007/04/who-pays-for-credit-card-rewards-and.html/comment-page-1#comment-104</link>
		<dc:creator>Customers Revenge</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 08 Apr 2007 02:34:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.thefinancebuff.com/?p=96#comment-104</guid>
		<description>Not sure if it is true that prices are up 2% because of credit cards.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;&lt;b&gt;First&lt;/b&gt;: Just because things cost less to the retailer doesn&#039;t mean you get a discount:  They just keep the 2% for themselves because the product is still worth the same amount to you.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;&lt;b&gt;Second&lt;/b&gt;: the credit card companies create more demand (people can buy with money they don&#039;t have), which creates more supply, which lowers the prices.  I wouldn&#039;t be surprised if the credit card industry lowered retail prices and increased retailer profits.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;However, they also bankrupt the consumers&#039; futures in the process.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Not sure if it is true that prices are up 2% because of credit cards.</p>
<p><b>First</b>: Just because things cost less to the retailer doesn&#8217;t mean you get a discount:  They just keep the 2% for themselves because the product is still worth the same amount to you.</p>
<p><b>Second</b>: the credit card companies create more demand (people can buy with money they don&#8217;t have), which creates more supply, which lowers the prices.  I wouldn&#8217;t be surprised if the credit card industry lowered retail prices and increased retailer profits.</p>
<p>However, they also bankrupt the consumers&#8217; futures in the process.</p>
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		<title>By: TFB</title>
		<link>http://thefinancebuff.com/2007/04/who-pays-for-credit-card-rewards-and.html/comment-page-1#comment-103</link>
		<dc:creator>TFB</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Apr 2007 23:08:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.thefinancebuff.com/?p=96#comment-103</guid>
		<description>broknowrchlatr,&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Thank you for your comments. Most businesses accept credit cards because there&#039;s an army of transactors demanding on using credit cards and getting their rebates and miles. Industry stats I read said 1/3 of all credit card users are Transactors and they generate 1/2 of the transaction volume. I don&#039;t think the industry would be pursuing the Transactors&#039; business if they merely break even on them. The DOJ document I quoted in the post showed Transactors are indeed profitable to the card companies.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>broknowrchlatr,</p>
<p>Thank you for your comments. Most businesses accept credit cards because there&#8217;s an army of transactors demanding on using credit cards and getting their rebates and miles. Industry stats I read said 1/3 of all credit card users are Transactors and they generate 1/2 of the transaction volume. I don&#8217;t think the industry would be pursuing the Transactors&#8217; business if they merely break even on them. The DOJ document I quoted in the post showed Transactors are indeed profitable to the card companies.</p>
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		<title>By: broknowrchlatr</title>
		<link>http://thefinancebuff.com/2007/04/who-pays-for-credit-card-rewards-and.html/comment-page-1#comment-102</link>
		<dc:creator>broknowrchlatr</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Apr 2007 12:28:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.thefinancebuff.com/?p=96#comment-102</guid>
		<description>It is important to point out that as most businesses accept credit cards.  Small, &quot;mom and pop&quot; stores that don&#039;t accept credit cards typically have higher prices, in my experience then large retail chains, so the benefit is lost.  &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Also, although 2.5% may be the merchant processing fee for a rewards card, many people do not have such cards.   I did soem google-ing and found 3 businesses that quoted their average merchant processing fees.  They were 1.6%, 1.71%, and 1.75%.  Using 1.7% and the 80% cc usage you used, the price comes out to be 1.36%.   If I have a cc with 1% cash back + 3% at grocery and gas, it prolly comes close to 1.36%.  To that you can tack on the convenience of the grace period.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;So, I&#039;d say that I, along with many Transactors, am probably about breaking even vs. what it would be like in a world without credit cards.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;p.s. wikipedia says 2%, but i&#039;m leaning toward the &#039;real&#039; merchant results.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is important to point out that as most businesses accept credit cards.  Small, &#8220;mom and pop&#8221; stores that don&#8217;t accept credit cards typically have higher prices, in my experience then large retail chains, so the benefit is lost.  </p>
<p>Also, although 2.5% may be the merchant processing fee for a rewards card, many people do not have such cards.   I did soem google-ing and found 3 businesses that quoted their average merchant processing fees.  They were 1.6%, 1.71%, and 1.75%.  Using 1.7% and the 80% cc usage you used, the price comes out to be 1.36%.   If I have a cc with 1% cash back + 3% at grocery and gas, it prolly comes close to 1.36%.  To that you can tack on the convenience of the grace period.</p>
<p>So, I&#8217;d say that I, along with many Transactors, am probably about breaking even vs. what it would be like in a world without credit cards.</p>
<p>p.s. wikipedia says 2%, but i&#8217;m leaning toward the &#8216;real&#8217; merchant results.</p>
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